I don't trust scientific results from scientists working for an organisation, that pays their salary and wants particular results, or working for an organisation that wants results favourable to their cause.DOC falls into that category.How safe was DDT? Probably that's how safe 1080 really is long term. Wonderful short-term results, but ominous long term results not measureable in a laboratory except in hindsight. How safe was 245T? Ask Vietnam vets and how much notice Government and "scientists" took of them. Salaries, research funds and projects are much more important than the real truth finding science.As those who get retired, fired or eliminated are aware to their detriment.The truth is that science is largely corrupt when monied, corporate or political influence is involved.If the rest of the world (apart form a very few exceptions NZ & Australia being two) has banned 1080 based on scientific reasons (and vision / observation is a legitimate scientific tool too) then why are our scientists so much at odds with that? Can't be for scientific reasons so it has to be political - DOC, Government and politicians, and "bought" scientists.
It is obvious that the only data considered reliable in the 1080 debate is that supplied by DOC. In this example of their data certain Kea were radio tagged to asses the death rate caused by 1080. 'DOC fitted radio transmitters to 29 West Coast kea - 10 in Arawhata Valley, two in the Hohonu Range, and 17 near the (Franz) and Fox Glaciers - to see if they survived 1080 drops. All (tagged) birds in the first two areas survived, but seven near the glacier died. Testing confirmed 1080 poisoning.'( NZ Herald July 30th 2008) Now on the face of it this seems ok, but if you imagine that for every 100 birds in the area, by my reckoning, and I am not a mathematician, 41 Kea were killed by the D.O.C .(41,000 per100,000) And then I am led to believe that by some miracle bordering on Divine intervention none were killed anywhere else. Now I may be nuts or a conspiracy theorist or born at night, but I was not born last night and I do not consider these numbers acceptable, nor am I inclined to believe that no 'collateral damage' occurred in the other areas. Records of Kea deaths (by 1080) have been documented as early as 1964 (Spurr, 1979; 1999) According to my book of Extinct NZ birds, written by Alan Tennyson the main cause of bird extinction in NZ are, in order, Humans, Rats and dare I mention them, the sacred NZ cat. The Possum, that gets all the attention is at the bottom of a long list (14th), and 'may have' caused the extinction of one species, the South Island Kokako. May have. I don't have the answer to the possum poison thing, but I think we are playing a very dangerous game spreading many tons of the most powerful poison registered with the U.N. in a blitzkrieg fashion all over this country. I am old enough to remember the great panacea for the worlds ills known as DDT and that the ‘ignorant masses’ somehow were aware of the dangers and that the experts rubbished them at every turn. I hope it doesn’t happen again.
In fact - it was not aerial 1080 operations in the Pureora Forest that has allowed some Kokako to survive - it was ground based trapping. (and as for Robins, up to 40% are killed in each aerial drop - (DoC research - presented in Poisoning Paradise documentary). The DoC study on Mapara showed 4 consecutive aerial 1080 drops, one year after another. It was not until ground control replaced the aerial operations that the Kokako numbers started to return to pre-drop counts. It was also proven that aerial 1080 did not reduce stoat numbers in Mapara - hence the 1000's of stoat traps placed around Mapara. 1080 is a poison, it kills anything that eats it, in suficient quantity (which is very little). 1080 is not a viatimin. 1080 is not a growth hormone, and it is not medicine. It is tasteless. It is odourless. It has no antidote. 1080 is mixed with an attractive food, and then dropped, indiscriminately, from helicopters. Therefore, it is hardly surprising that so many non-target species are killed and sub-lethally poisoned in aerial operations. New reasearch is currently underway that is developing sensible, effective solutions to aerial poisoning operations. And after a billion dollars has been spent by the bureaucracies DoC, AHB, and regional councils - providing their "poisoning solutions" (and taking into consideration that we still have 70 million possums) - it is ironic that this research is not being initiated by DoC and their toxin spreading buddies, but rather - caring, responsible, unfunded, members of the public.
I am extremely surprised at the comments made by everyone. The impacts of introduced mammalian pests in New Zealand far outweigh the impact of 1080 poisoning. After watching a few emotive, unscientific tv/dvd documentaries everyone is suddenly an expert. If anyone bothered to actually read scientific research (not only DoC funded work) it would become apparent that we need to keep pest numbers down and currently 1080 is a viable option. Kokako and robin and numbers have increased significantly in Pureora forest following 1080 poisoning. I suggest that the bent spoon award might be a little harsh. However, emotive documentaries should always be viewed with some skepticism and viewers should always attempt to find out the facts about as much as possible prior to internet slagging.
Doc is deserving of the Bent Spoon Award. The lies, and persuasive nonscence that they force upon us is too slowly being exposed. What's it going to take, people being found dead in their own homes. Dairy exports shut down when overseas realises our cows are quite often drinking water where 1080 has been put into their water catchment areas. For those who think they KNOW it all I have a small stream metres from our house where 8 Farms, Families a Nursery, Dairy Cows, Drinking water, everything comes from that water/bush. 1/2km either way is the same thing, all the way around the Egmont National Park Taranaki. And they are puting tons of this Deadly Poison into these areas. For those of you who doubt the lack of Bird Life, and Long Term Destruction check out bush that has had 1080, and bush that hasn,t. Where 1080 has been there is no Insects Lizards Spiders Whetas Butterflies and very few birds.
Clyde....send the DVD to overseas' Tourism Operators and their Govt counterparts ...... if they start asking the questions you'll see some real ducking for cover !
Well TV1 sure lived up to the "follow the Govt line! TV Station"! We all know where their dollars come from!Come on TV3 show us you have nuts! Are you all City dwellers whom don't give a stuff if DOC and AHB stuff the environment? Where do you think meat comes from (obviously in nice neat plastic bags!)? No! it comes from farms that about 30% of have 1080 regularly sprayed on them so eat up! It might take 20kg's to kill you immediately but it only takes grams to make you weak and susceptible to other organisms! Hope you enjoy you meat dinner tonight! SHOW THE GRAFS DVD! I'll bet you don't even allow this to be veiwed! Lloyd Hanson
NZ seems to have a plague of rats right now.The most damaging to mankind and all wildlife are the DoC species
I think if the Skeptics Society talk about an award, they should be prepared to give it. Maybe if they bothered to contact the Graf Boys and offer to hold a ceremony to accept the award, the Graf Boys would be pleased to attend?Come on, skeptics! Or do you even doubt your own ability to respond correctly????
I see TV one are running a special on 1080 tonight....6pm tonight TV three you should be showing the DVD. All New Zealanders should be pushing for an complete stop on 1080 and a full idependant enquiry (not a doc funded ERMa review)