There’s one really annoying thing about working in television news, and it’s the fact you rely on pictures to tell a story. By pictures, I mean interviews: On camera. Talking heads. Chatting to someone on the phone won’t do: No pictures. E-mail correspondence back and forth: No pictures.
Quite a few of my story ideas die a painful death this way: It’s really annoying. For the last month I’ve been planning to do a story about Odd Future being pulled from the Big Day Out. I’ve been in contact with their manager for weeks, as he’s tried to get Tyler, The Creator (Odd Future’s ringleader, so to speak) to Skype me. I felt I needed his comment to freshen up the story, which has already played out on Public Address, The Herald, Stuff.co.nz, and here on 3 News. I wanted Tyler, as no-one had spoken to him about it. Odd Future being pulled from the bill is a bit of a new one for the group: They’ve played Coachella, but they are not allowed to play the Big Day Out.
But Tyler’s been busy: If he wasn’t playing gigs in Brazil, he was opening OF-merchandise stores on Fairfax (which he attended in a cat T-shirt, whilst clutching an actual, purring cat). I get the feeling his manager was doing his darndest for me (thanks)… but Tyler wasn’t playing ball.
Along the way I’ve spoken to a few players, and while I’m sort of used to just dumping stuff in the wastebasket, I thought I’d just type out some transcripts and let you read them, because I think it’s a really interesting issue.
As a bit of background, Odd Future Wolf Gang Kill Them All (or simple Odd Future, or OF) are a young hip-hop collective from LA. There are about 11 of them.
They happily dribbled out music for free on their blog for years: It was rough, both production-wise and lyrically, as they happily barked on about necrophilia, torture and rape. Some of their songs could happily be classified as horror-core, although hating labels, they’d probably tell you otherwise.
As with many underground things on the internet, they went mainstream (this could be in part due to Tyler’s love of cats). Heck, Tyler released a solo record and won himself an MTV award which was presented by the wolf from Twilight. They played intimate showcase gigs and massive festivals.
Then, OF were announced to play the Big Day Out. Fans were happy. Non-fans didn’t care. Then a man called Calum Bennachie wrote an email to the organisers of the Big Day Out stating why Tyler and his merry band of followers shouldn’t play. He CC’d in a number of members of the Auckland Council (who look after the BDO venue), including Sandra Coney, chairwoman of the council's Parks and Heritage Forum. Then Odd Future was pulled from the Big Day Out.
First up, I decided to get in touch with Mr Bennachie, who took exception to OF playing the BDO. It’s interesting to note Mr Bennachie was also one of those who led the petition that saw Beenie Man banned from the 2010 Big Day Out. I was curious to see him expand on his reasons for writing his letter, and to find out what kind of feedback he’s gotten since his name was bandied about in the media as the guy who got OF kicked out.
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What is your problem with Odd Future?
It’s claimed that their music isn't homophobic, racist, or mysogynistic, because they have a lesbian in the band and include people of colour in the group. Yet would be right for a woman, a feminist to say that it’s okay to harm other women? Would it be okay for a black person to encourage people “to beat up all da niggaz”? It’s also claimed that the only way they can get ahead in the music business is to sign music like that. To me, that's a bit like someone here saying that to make it big in radio and TV industry, they have to copy Paul Henry, and his racist slurs. But, hang on, there's John Campbell, Mike McRoberts, Hilary Barry, Simon Dallow, Wendy Petrie and many, many others who didn't follow the Paul Henry route. Similarly, there are those in the music business who don't sing about getting coffins ready for gay men. Their lyrics encourage people to treat women, people of different ethnicities and LGBT people as second class citizens, not worthy of citizenship, not worthy of being real people, and that it is acceptable to abuse and threaten them. Too often gay men are targeted as objects of violence or ridicule in the streets, the perpetrators feeling safe in doing so because of the messages in hate music. It also contributes to lack of severity in sentences passed on those who kill gay men, “because they deserve it”, or “because he came on to me”. Tyler stated in NME in relation to challenges about his lyrics and replied with “I’m not homophobic. I just think 'faggot' hits and hurts people. It hits. And 'gay' just means you’re stupid. I don't know, we don’t think about it, we're just kids. We don’t think about that shit”. I'd like him to imagine this: You're a gay man walking along K Road, on your way to meet friends at a gay bar. You hear footsteps behind you, a small group. A glance shows three young guys posturing as they walk along. You remember that there has been a lot of violence on K Road in the past few months. Your mouth dries up, your heart beats faster, you walk a little faster, but the group keeps tabs with you. Then one shouts at you: “Oi, faggot, I pre-ordered your casket”. You remember that a well known gay man was so badly assaulted on K Road in June, that he was in an induced coma for 2 weeks and is still not out of hospital. Is it going to be you in that situation tonight? When is that king hit going to arrive, when is that punch going to hit?
What reaction have you gotten since the cancellation? I imagine people have been quite outspoken back at you?
I’ve had around a dozen death threats, with dozens more threats of violence. Out of all the abuse I got, one later apologised, proving that not all OF fans are the same, they are not all violent, and for every threat I got, there are probably hundreds more who never even thought of making a threat of any kind. It’s a bit like blaming me for the errors of BDO. BDO knew what could happen: They had the example of Beenie Man two years ago. Despite signing a paper in 2009 saying he would not perform homophobic lyrics again, Beenie Man was doing so again this year. BDO had this example, and refused to learn from it. Any blame people are trying to put on me, should be put on BDO for their mishandling and mismanagement of the situation, and lack of learning from the incident in 2009. Freedom of expression isn’t just a freedom, it's also a responsibility. There are many things you cannot say: fire in a crowded theatre, fighting words that encourage people to riot or assault others, and New Zealand has some specific rules around controlling freedom of expression - laws against racial or sexual harassment, and racial incitement. You cannot defame some one. Freedom of expression is not absolute, despite what people think - even in the United States there are restrictions on freedom of expression.
Baring in mind the feedback from people, would you do it again?
Would I do it again? I did it in 2009 with Beenie Man, who wanted to fill gay men with copper and lead. I would have hoped that BDO would have learned some social responsibility over that, but it seems they didn't. Because BDO are slow learners, I had to take action again. I hope that by now, BDO have learned their lesson, and will not continue to bring over music that specifically threatens people with violence. I therefore hope that I do not have to do this again, but if BDO have still not learned their lesson, it is likely that it will be done again.
There's talk of OF having their own show in Auckland. What are your thoughts on this?
With having the separate concert, BDO are proving they have little thought for the rights of others, for the safety of others, and are demonstrating little social responsibility. I hope that when someone is assaulted because of their sexual orientation, or their gender, or their ethnicity, they will think back about what they have allowed to happen.
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So, that was what Bennachie had to say. Next, I was curious to talk to a gay person who had a different opinion about Odd Future: A gay person who was a fan of the group. That person ended up being Debuse Onte, a lesbian based in Auckland. She wrote a blog in response to OF being dropped. This interview was conducted in person in Auckland.
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What motivated you to write your blog post originally?
It was more of the idea that a lot of the gay community was fighting against this one group without realising what was happening. From my point of view, I love Odd Future, and I know a lot of people who love Odd Future. But coming from a lesbian, I don’t find them to be homophobic. But a lot of people see it differently.
How long have you been a fan for?
Since I first heard Frank Ocean’s Novacane. So last year.
Calum, who led this lobby, obviously says he thinks OF are homophobic. Why would you argue that they’re not homophobic?
I think these days a lot of the younger generation use those homophobic terms, but in a different way. And I think that’s what a lot of people need to realise is that it’s not what it is anymore. Not everybody is going to go around and say “oh that’s gay”, and think it’s a gay person, and go bash them. It’s not like that anymore. And I know a lot of people disagree with me on that, that using those terms will get people to think homophobically or whatever, but I think people think differently now.
Ok. How do you think this issue is split in the gay community? I mean, obviously you don’t know every gay person in the country, but are your views a minority, or are they split more like 50/50?
As far as I know, a lot of my friends who have heard of OF but don’t necessarily listen to them didn’t know what the lyrics were, and when they heard that they were saying “faggot” and all that stuff, they were like “oh yeah they are homophobic a little bit”. Some of them were like “Yeah, I’ve heard them. They’re not homophobic at all”. I reckon it’s about…. 30/70.
Do you think that 70 percent needs to chill-out a little bit?
I don’t think it’s about chilling out. It’s the same way that I understand OF and now they tell the story lyrically, I think it’s the same way people should understand Calum. I understand where he’s coming from. I understand as someone in the gay community the fear we have of these words. I get that. I’ve been through it. And like I was saying before: I mean it’s – being an asian – having those words thrown at you from everywhere – it’s sort of like, okay, I understand where you’re coming from. But also you need to understand the other side.
Do you think Tyler and his crew need to tone it down or are they fine?
I personally think they’re hilarious. I think what they’re doing is perfect. I read once how Tyler was asked why he writes about murder and rape and that sort of thing, and he said “Look, I’ve been so interested in serial killers – I’ve been reading books about serial killers – I just wanted to write out what was in my head”. I know so many people who read serial killer books. Who love those stories. And I guess for Tyler it’s just his outlet of saying things that’s in his head and bringing that up.
Doesn’t mean he’s actually gonna go and do it himself.
No. I mean, let’s face it, do we really think he’s gonna go rape Taylor Swift? Or is he gonna go stab Bruno Mars? No.
Probably not going to happen.
Not so much. And if it does… I’m sorry! I’ll eat my words!
The guy won an MTV award. One of the most mainstream awards you can win. Taylor Lautner handed him the award…
Exactly. And it’s a lot like the battle with Eminem when he was coming out. A lot of people took issue with his lyrics, but after awhile they realised “Oh okay, he’s telling a story”. That’s what it is.
Beenie Man was banned. And now Tyler. Is there a difference between those two artists in your mind?
Personally I think there is. Just because I know Beenie Man is homophobic. When he uses those terms he actually means it as it is, he means it towards that minority. Whereas with Tyler, it’s not. If you actually listen to the lyrics, instead of just reading (excepts) on paper, you will see it’s not against that group, it’s just saying “that guys a dumbass”, but using a term that used to be used to hate on a certain group, but changing the meaning.
So you’re saying it needs to be taken in context?
Exactly. I mean the same way he uses the word “nigger”, he’s black, he’s saying “nigger”, and it’s a bad way of saying it – but he’s not saying it because that guys black, he’s saying it’s because “this guy has no job and I’m better than him!” sort of thing.
Anything else you’d like to add?
I’d just say I understand that people have reservations about these words, especially during these times where we get a lot of kids committing suicide because of the words people use. I get that. But we need to remember these kids who are throwing those words around cannot be stopped using those words. And I would say the only thing we can do – and correct me if I’m wrong – is to change the meaning of these words instead of making them harmful.
So I assume you’ll be going to Tyler’s show if he puts it on?
Definitely. That’s if I can score some tickets.
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Finally, I spoke to Sandra Coney (chairwoman of the council's Parks and Heritage Forum) on the phone… but she wouldn’t go on record on camera. John Brockie (CEO of Regional Facilities) wouldn’t be interviewed on camera, or comment at all. I was left with this from Paul Brewer, external relations, Auckland Council. Here’s an excerpt from our conversation:
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What did the Auckland Council have to do with the cancellation of Odd Future, to your knowledge?
The Council had nothing to do with the cancellation. It was the Big Day Out. We simply passed on to the organisers the concerns expressed by Sandra (Coney) and left it at that. Any decision was made by the organisers. It was nothing to do with us.
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The Big Day Out would not return any of my emails.
As for Tyler, if he gets in touch I’ll add it to this blog. The last comment he made on this issue was on his twitter account @fucktyler, on November 25. It read like this, in his usually charming manner of allcaps:
AND IM THANKFUL FOR THEM HATING ASS GAY ACTIVISTS IN NEW ZEALAND, BECAUSE I CAN NOW BRAG TO BITCHES THAT IM BANNED FROM A COUNTRY. SO TIGHT!
Purely from an editorial perspective, I’m gonna say when you picture that being said by a guy clutching a cat, it’s hard to take it all too seriously.