Diplomats quiet on Trans-Pacific Partnership progress

16/12/2012 12:25:08 p.m.

Kathy wrote:

NO Mike you are just fighting a losing argument. No one at all in that claim is saying revenue = profit. You are just parading around the argument like everyone is making it, however none of the stories I linked you to made that claim. What they said was of the world total GDP figure... 5 percent is being stolen by the wealthy and sheltered by companies like Goldman Sachs. And yes I put down the worng figure the figure is closer to 3.45 Trillion per year now times that by 6... though I am sure you could have tried to work out what 5 percent was. It amazes me how corrupt you are Mike, and how many complete fallcies you try to get people to believe. Our own universities released figures showing what the wealthy were stealing from New Zealand. And those figures actually match up with the Tax Justice Leagues claim. You are just a rabid nasty little man, that doesnt like being proven wrong. In this case you are completely wrong and have no idea what you are on about. The guilty always claim their innocence overly loudly. And you are one guilty man... should we put it to the test and get a forensic tax specialist to examine your accounts?.

16/12/2012 9:13:52 a.m.

Mike wrote:

Still you read the headline and didn't activate even 'ONE' baincell as this would be too much to ask.

The whole claim is built on assumptions like revenue=profit and inflation should be taxed. But someone with zero business knowledge like you wont listen or even read any deeper as it doesn't suit and your lack of education would show.

You still haven't addressed how revenue=profit has to affect an economy to contradict what I have said, because you can't, so your back to your fanatical name calling vs address revenue=profit.

Your problem is your a brainless lying leftist and anyone who challenges your lies you call a liar. How about you do some explaining of how you come up with your figures vs personal attacks?

The $21 trillion evasion still is impossible and you need to use revenue=profit and taxing inflation to approach it.

The so-called rich put their profits through businesses and trust as the business/trusts are a lower tax rate, and dont draw the income so dont pay higher taxes, leaving it in the businesses/trust. If they draw the income later they get taxed at higher personal rates later. But profits are not 5% of the worlds GDP, they are around 1% of the non-governemnt GDP.

You claiming 2.76 trillion x 6 years = $21 trillion, YOU CANT EVEN ADD! LET ALONE MULTIPLY!

69 trillion GDP, about 1/2 that goverment. so that leaves around 35 trillion, and around 350 billion profit for ALL the businesses and trusts in the world, on which they are taxed, coming back to around 70 billion of possible evasion if they paid NO TAX, when they do pay tax.

Explain how these socalled rich are evading? Well they are not drawing income, so not paying personal income tax rates on income they didn't collect, but even if they drew the whole lot, they would pay around 6% more income tax, on the profit. If stretched it to 10% higher (NZ 28% business, 33% personal, ie 5%), thats around 35 billion a year vs 35,000 billion a year in your claim!

15/12/2012 12:38:00 p.m.

Kathy wrote:

Mike, more logical fallacies (lies wrapped in logic.. people should read about these as politicians use them all the time). The story said the worlds rich.. not solely business to start with. New Zealand figures released this year showed that the wealthy were stealing about 5 percent of the countries total GDP figure (148 Billion, Nominal GDP or adjusted for inflation figure). The story about the 21 trillion dollars also quite clearly stated that the money had been stolen over a 6 year period since the beginning of the financial collapse (but Mike cant read). So if you take 5 percent of the worlds total GDP figure of 69 Trillion you get 2.76 trillion dollars stolen per year. Times that by 6 years yet get a total of 21 Trillion dollars stolen by the wealthy elite. These figure are on par with the figures released about the money that people like Mike are stealing fropm our economy each and every year. What Mike is doing is lieing.. wrappping in in completely warped logic and trying to pass it off as truth.. which it isnt. 21 Trillion dollars stolen over a 6 year period by the wealthy elite actually does stack up to scrutiny when compared to the figures that we ourselves have about what is stolen from people like Mike each year from our own economy.

15/12/2012 7:25:31 a.m.

Mike wrote:

@ Kathy Go further and consider the business tax evasion possible on current world GDP.

Revenue is not profit. Any tax person knows it from either IRD or the business side, yet you dont, so therefore you have 0 business knowledge and your claimed business knowledge is a fraud.

We have government expenditure. Even in NZ with less government expenditure % than average, we are almost 50%.

So use business revenue around 35 tril.

Business profit % around 1% of that. Yes some are higher, but the average is around 1%. So world business profit around $350 billion PA.

Average business tax rate is around 20%, or around $70 billion PA.

The amount of business tax paid annually in the world is higher than this as businesses dont get refunds on tax credits, ie when they make losses. Those they carry forward for when they do actually make a profit.

An annual evasion figure possible if no business paid tax would be around 70 billion (and they do pay taxes), and some how you stretch this to $21 trillion? Thats more profit than businesses have ever made in the planets history! How much was the world GDP 10/20/50/100 years ago? It diminishes as you go back in history.

Even if had 3% revenue as average business profit and extreme US 35% business tax rate, you still cant stretch 21 tril of evasion in the planets history. Average profit much less than 3% of revenue. Eg the excessive and greedy Aussie Banks, 1.19% was considered high profits with the average around 0.6%.

14/12/2012 1:47:00 a.m.

Isaac wrote:

We may as well get ready and make the most of the things that mater. The exploitation of a finite world for money has only one end whether in our lifetime or that of our children the collapse of the monetary system will only be replaced by another fake system of control, probably cashless credit. It is interesting to see the implementation of the covert Amero dollar making a show and it representatives must be salivating at the potential debts of the not yet enslaved Canadian and Mexican people to distribute the bankrupt American financial future. My advise would be keep your ideas to yourself and get used to paying for your right to exist.

13/12/2012 10:01:39 p.m.

Kathy wrote:

Isnt it funny that the worlds GDP is valued at 69 Trillion dollars. 3 times the value you claim the world has never collectively made in its history Mike (man you lie to the extreme). A lot of misinformation comes from you and your posts. Isnt it sad then that all the polls including the betting sites such as ipredict are now predicting National (the party who protects tax evaders like yourself) wont win the next election. Must make you cry bitter tears. I have the feeling that if we sent a forensic tax specialist to examine all of your past income tax returns that there would be a 99 percent chance of you would be going to jail.

13/12/2012 8:21:25 a.m.

Greg wrote:

What the TTP effectively means is that American corporations will not have to pay Welcome to the Cuba of the pacific. Nothing short of a revolution will throw this dog of a deal of our backs. Mike it has nothing to to do with trade, care to sit down and have a beer with me at the maritime museum in Auckland central and prove it is.

13/12/2012 7:30:11 a.m.

@WISEACRE wrote:

Even Australia with its pro NWO/UN/US 1 seat majority won't sign away FOREVER the rights of its people because they know the consequences.

13/12/2012 7:19:03 a.m.

Preoccupied wrote:

Why is the determination of the Future Country of NZ to be decided by un-elected bureaucrats and why are these idealogical types who disregard the rule of law believe that the public are just gentile cattle.

13/12/2012 7:00:30 a.m.

Mike wrote:

The real purpose of the anti-TPP people is to halt all progress, and move us back to the traditional tech of the caveman.

Lets be honest, the same people protesting cant add 2+2 together and claim businesses are greedy stealing jobs of hard working unemployed, and they not paying their taxes on revenue, as according to the left loons, revenue=profit, and they blame all ills of the world on businesses, and want to destroy them.

That destroying the businesses will also destroy the welfare state they want is almost funny. And while they are pushing for their ideal, they are trying to move the world into a police state without democracy. How much sitting on their backsides would they get to do in left run police states like USSR before it fell, or China currently?

NZ been borrowing as a country for 40 years, last having a true surplus (vs Labour creative accounting surplus) back in 1973. Borrowing is not sustainable, nor is wage rises without productivity gains. The whole revenue=profit gives runaway inflation that would lose 99.9% of jobs, and still they support its false claims.

They hit back with personal attacks vs address any issue. They make wild claims like $21 trillion in tax evasion, when this is more profit than businesses around the world have made through the worlds history! They ignore the PAYE and GST/VAT that businesses bring to the economy. Take making the hobbit which has already dropped over $100 mil in PAYE into govt coffers whcih excedes the small cost Keys negotiated after the unions stabbed NZ in the back for overseas interests, or Labours already 15% tax rebate!.

There are sell-outs. Take the NZ union backing of overseas bids for the hobbit - they are true sell-outs. Or Labours direction to ACC/Kiwisaver to invest in overseas crooks lie Maddoff that lost around $29 billion!