UN rep visits Waitangi marae

23/10/2010 8:38:35 a.m.

atrout wrote:

Hi TWE and a couple more... you are truly wasting your time and intellect in this forum. You are up against some passionate, unreasoning people suffering from Joan of Arc syndrome and other delusions. As even the Labour Party has said, Maori separate governance will never happen. It can't and shouldn't- even citing Mugabe doesn't turn on any lights in the brains of those who advocate 'landlordship' for Maori for all current freehold title. Just try to think what would happen to our social and economic base. Who would willingly give up their investments in land and business to a landlord who assumes control of the asset without any vested interest in the economic value of the asset? Who would hand over freehold title of their home, bach or forestry block (carbon credits to who?) to another individual on the basis of whakapapa? Weird thought at the looniest of times. Who, by the way would determine first dibs on any title on the basis of whakapapa? Manwhenua or tangatawhenua, married to a Chinese immigrant and not knowing one's whakapapa but being darned sure of having at least one Maori ancestor? Get real, it ain't gonna happen and if any form of it did occur then this country would be running to the UN seeking massive economic support to stave off total economic and therefore social collapse. Give NZ another 20 years and a continued invasion of international entertainment media and we will be a different nation. Check out what is happening to te Reo and Maori educational institutions. Young Maori are voting with their feet. Identifying with US Black youth culture will have a far greater effect on Maori culture than all the rabid White Joans of Arc shrieking out on a few online comment forums. Remember this when the Maori Party fades away, which will happen. Evil forces are not out there doing all this, but the power of cultural assimilation and development out of the rest of the Western World will prevail. Not even the UN can succeed with it's creepy agenda given the power of the media to grab the minds of young people equipped with credit cards. Jan and your friends,quit dreaming of vindictive justice and enjoy the video- it's more real than your politics.

29/07/2010 7:31:51 p.m.

Jan.. wrote:

What do you really called Crown matey? is it something to do with the war between England Scotland and Ireland?..
You guys must be joking..
The Tangata Whenua are the true LandLords of this Land of NZ..

29/07/2010 10:11:33 a.m.

Hanson Hillberry wrote:

TWE I take it you got the message being not to sadistically disadvantage Maori at any opportunity while they seek independent of Pakeha thinking to advance their own cause, to do so is an act of racial discrimination where you clearly, irrefutably expressed numerous times through your posts. It appears that you advocate that it’s ok to deplore Maori, criticize Maori and discriminate Maori whenever you like while stupidly using unsubstantiated facts to support your argument in a failed attempt to manipulate readers to reinforce your colonial rule view as the standard view here in NZ; as you’ve realized now that’s not the case. Your own kin disagrees with your mentally bent motives to continue oppressing the Maori people. Either sort your psychological disturbances out or do everyone a favour and move on because we simply don’t need those evil ideals around to continually plague what could be a better society for all.

TWE for you to threaten civil war to prevent Maori from exercising their right to pursue self determination in every sense of the interpretation and share in the same liberties and freedoms that you and I are entitled too is truly a desturbing, self centered, immoral act. You have to agree with me that for anyone to think that way deserves a NO BRAINER medal right? Ha ha ha! I just hope you’ve learnt a lesson.

26/07/2010 9:58:59 p.m.

TWE wrote:

A rubbish reply, once again. You conveniently ignored my statement about returning surplus land and the hundreds of millions of dollars in compensation, and accuse me of making racial slurs which is a complete lie. I have not used a single one, and have kept this discussion far more civil than you have. I've said all I have to say, and this will be my last reply.

26/07/2010 11:58:07 a.m.

Hanson Hillberry wrote:

TWE it's very offensive of you to stupidly attack Ngai Tahu’s successful economic port folio and governance structures by ridiculously comparing them to say what we would consider a mainstream corporate entity and how it operates; there’s absolutely no comparison between the two organizations other than complying to imposed governmental regulation policies and procedures; which includes transparency so your accountability claim is absolutely stupid and fact-less.

TWE the short answer is Ngai Tahu have provided a number of well designed initiatives to service Ngai Tahu’s needs. I’ll list some as it’s a successful road map for all Iwi to take interest in:

1. Iwi Radio
2. Iwi TV Channel
3. Employment – Fisheries, Agriculture, Environment, Culture
4. Education – Wananga, scholarships and employment
5. Trade – Export

I’m sure there are many, many more beneficial initiatives that Ngai Tahu are implementing and power to them, nothing like what you mention in your unfounded rhetoric in fact quite the contrary.

TWE you have an innate tendency to woffle and when you do racial slurs automatically pop to the surface similar to a tourette sufferer though you are in full control of your actions. Seek psychological support to reverse your ill feelings toward Maori.

Your admission to Yes Pakeha stole the land but won’t give it back to Maori because the stolen land is now populated and what will happen to them? is pathetic! It tells me that you will vigorously stand your immoral ground to prove that an immoral act is virtuous; I don’t buy it and nor does the majority of Pakehadom.

Would landlord title be a compromise? Would a collaborative arrangement with Maori be much better than a non collaborative arrangement with Maori? Civil war isn't an option, stupid!

TWE, it’s good that you brought Ngai Tahu into the discussion because if there is an Iwi that’s best suited to secede, Ngai Tahu is that Iwi. Maori don't need to unite as a collective to secede.

25/07/2010 6:50:01 p.m.

TWE wrote:

Answering a question with another question? Very well. 1. Did the Crown and our invading ancestors illegitimately steal land from the Maori? Yes 2. Do you think we should honourably return the land to Maori? Which land in particular? What if it has people already living on it? Do a Mugabe and kick them all off? Short answer - No, Maori have been compensated with hundreds of millions of dollars, plus 'surplus Crown land' often located in areas of high value. This is why so many people are angry when we are told this isn't enough. 3. Why is the Government prolonging the return of stolen land back to Maori? See #2 This discussion wasn't even about land in the first place. It's about the UN having no business attempting to interfere with a sovereign nation. What about my question?

25/07/2010 3:52:30 p.m.

Hanson Hillberry wrote:

TWE your response is laughable; its one way to back out of a no brain argument considering the mix is in the pudding so to speak and plastered on the wall, ha ha ha. You are what you write there’s no denying that, ha ha ha

I will answer your Ngai Tahu Corporate questions as you wish but before that I think it be wise that you answer Anne’s questions first in case you get labeled a coward; ha ha ha

So let’s not get ahead of ourselves even though you must feel that you are backed up into a corner or up against the wall; ha ha ha … To reiterate:

1. Did the Crown and our invading ancestors illegitimately steal land from the Maori?

2. Do you think we should honourably return the land to Maori?

3. Why is the Government prolonging the return of stolen land back to Maori?

So that you know my psychological assessment of you remains unchanged nor likely to change.

Hurry up Racist Slave Master answer the questions!

25/07/2010 12:29:41 p.m.

TWE wrote:

Seems I struck a nerve. You didn't really have anything substantial to counter with so resorted to personal attacks instead. Crown agents and medals? I don't even like the government and you're just making ridiculous things up now. Do you deny that Ngai Tahu is a corporation? they are in every sense of the word. They are not a traditionally-oriented tribe but a money-oriented corporation, interested in... making money and not much else. As for your allegations of slavery, the British made slavery illegal when they annexed NZ in 1840. Maori themselves kept prisoners of war as slaves.

25/07/2010 10:33:44 a.m.

Hanson Hillberry wrote:

TWE threatens civil war as a solution to not return stolen land back to Maori therefore supporting the irrefutable criminal act of an illegitimate invasion paints a very disturbing psychological picture of you. Besides you being absolutely stupid and severely lacking of not only moral values but the ability to reason when conclusive evidence is put before you is freakishly alarming. I know there are some stupid people around but you top the list; I guess you’re anticipating Crown agents to award you a no brainer medal for it? They will and appoint you minister of defense as well.

Maori were forced off their land remember the scorched earth policy, early 19 hundreds, Urewera’s, Taranaki and many other territories or is that TWE selective memory loss in play yet again.

You also wrote …‘There are people all over the world who have been OPPRESSED far more than Maori ever were, I would go so far as to say that Maori are presently treated far better than many of those other groups. WHY do they DESERVE far more than these other groups ever got?’

TWE, idiot! SLAVERY in any capacity is illegal. It’s clear that you argue that the oppressed Maori on their own illegally confiscated land are not privileged to equally participate in societal norms; one being economic development and another being self governance. Racial Discrimination is an illness that you obviously suffer from; the Crown therefore ought to cover your medical expenses to help reverse your mental disorder after all, the Crown programmed you in the first place.
You wrote … ‘If land is returned to them (Maori you disrespectful pr*ck) as you desire etc Corporate Maori bla bla’

For starters you have no right to determine the future for Maori, control freak! And to attempt to finish on a compassionate note is contradictory of your whole demeanor no one will buy it. Admit it you’re a slave master, control freak, extremist, low life and inherently brain washed with Dark Age’s Syndrome, that’s a fact!

23/07/2010 5:07:10 p.m.

TWE wrote:

The native Americans and Australian Aborigines who were forcibly removed from their ancestral lands never got any justice, someone mentioned Texas, where the Mexicans were all run off their lands, I could go on and on. There are people all over the world who have been oppressed far more than Maori ever were, I would go so far as to say that Maori are presently treated far better than many of those other groups. Why do they deserve far more than these other groups ever got? If land is returned to them as you desire, it would be given to the iwi, which I cannot see as being anything more than corporations - Ngai Tahu in particular. They care very little or not at all for their culture, only making money. They use their culture as a tool to make as much money as they can get out of it. Like any corporation, a few people at the top get the majority of the wealth and the people down below get relatively little. If the land was given back by the Crown, I don't believe it would be distributed fairly to the members of these iwi, just as the monetary wealth is not today. I'm sorry but I cannot see it being a positive thing for the Maori who need help most of all, they will be no better off. All it will do is enrich those who already take more than they deserve.